[JPL] valve trombonists & trumpeters

George Thomas gthomas at vpr.net
Wed Dec 21 13:57:49 EST 2011


As a former French horn player I'd like to point out that there
are several ways "digital" valve instruments can hit those notes
"in the cracks." Trumpet players can half-depress the valves, like
Dizzy & many other players, and horn players can use their right hand
in the bell of the instrument to get 1/4 tones, etc.

And then, as Gene points out, there are all the possible changes in embouchure.

One of my favorite Bob Brookmeyer recordings is the live one he did with
Ted Rosenthal for Planet Arts "One Night In Vermont." Recorded in Wilmington, VT
a decade before the town was devastated by a flood this year.

George 

Jazz In The Evening with George Thomas
Vermont Public Radio
365 Troy Ave
Colchester, VT 05446

802-654-4343
jazz at vpr.net
www.vpr.net
Mon-Thu 9-11pm, Fri 9pm-mid


----- Original Message -----
From: jctrane at gmail.com
To: jazzproglist at jazzweek.com
Sent: Wednesday, December 21, 2011 1:17:36 PM
Subject: Re: [JPL] valve trombonists & trumpeters


There really isn't another brass instrument (saving perhaps, French Horn)
that makes the same demands on the player than trombone does. I like to
think (simplistically) of  'bone being an  'analog' instrument and valve
instruments as being 'digital'.  As such, a bone can play "in the cracks"
between notes more completely, as can the string instruments which are also
analog. It isn't quit as simple as striking a key on the piano, but valve
instruments are on the piano (digital) model (altho'  modifications in
embouchure can permit valve players to 'bend' notes.
   i have always thought that the reason so many trombonists become good
arrangers (Brookmeyer comes most immediately to mind here) is that they are
used to listening very carefully to the sound they are making; very slight
adjustments on the slide can alter the  pitch of the note. Beginning bone
players really have to use their ears from the very start in order to make
the fine adjustments in slide position to play in tune. Thus, the
arranger's art should come naturally to them.
   I once asked John Fedchock about the plethora of bone-arrangers and
tried my "listen-intently" hypothesis on him. He disagreed with me. He said
that he thought that the reason there were so many bone-arrangers was
simply...financial. Sorry to say (as a former bone player, myself) in jazz,
bones are dispensable in the small group setting. It's sax and trumpet
players who get the front-line work. So, trombone players, if they are
going to make a career in music, have to develop other skills to keep food
on the table.
     Gene Abkarian

On Wed, Dec 21, 2011 at 10:03 AM, Jae Sinnett <jaejazz at yahoo.com> wrote:

>
> Mouthpiece may also have something to do with this but not sure. Seems it
> would be easier to go to a bigger then to a smaller. Hence why we don't see
> many trombonists coming to trumpet. The physical-ness of playing the
> trumpet is very different too. How many hernia operations did Maynard have?
> At least 10 I think but that was a result of "how" he played. I don't think
> "clef" ranges make much difference in this but that could be a factor too
> but I doubt this one. Bb to Eb vs Eb to Bb. Steve Wilson is the only
> saxophonist that prefers to read in "concert" rather that Eb (alto) or Bb
> (tenor, soprano).
>
> Jae Sinnett
>
>
> ________________________________
>  From: John Simna <jsimna at wclv.com>
> To: jazzproglist at jazzweek.com
> Sent: Wednesday, December 21, 2011 11:49 AM
> Subject: RE: [JPL] valve trombonists & trumpeters
>
>
>
> arturo at kuvo.org writes:
>
> I've  noticed that several trumpeters also play valve  trombone
>
> And Ed said:
> Maynard Ferguson among them. As you suggest, I think it's easier for a
> trumpet player to adapt to another piston/valve instrument than a slide;
> but
>
> since I play neither, I defer to experts.
>
> Ed
>
>
>
>
> Multi-instrumentalist James Morrison is an exception to this - here's a
> video ssample:
>
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5JRKnO83P_E
>
> It may be that trumpeters who double find it easier to use the vale
> instrument, but a lot of trombonists will double euphonium, a valve
> instrument of the same range as the trombone - in fact in professional
> orchestras, when there is a euphonium part, such as in Holst's suite The
> Planets,  it's usually one of the trombonists who specializes in that (as
> well as bass trumpet).
>
> John Simna
> jsimna at wclv.com
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: jazzproglist-bounces at jazzweek.com
> [mailto:jazzproglist-bounces at jazzweek.com] On Behalf Of EdBride at aol.com
> Sent: Wednesday, December 21, 2011 11:33 AM
> To: jazzproglist at jazzweek.com
> Subject: Re: [JPL] valve trombonists & trumpeters
>
>
>
>
> In a message dated 12/21/2011 11:28:03 A.M. Eastern Standard Time,
>
> --
>
> Jazz Programmers' Mailing List: jazzproglist at jazzweek.com
> List information: http://lists.jazzweek.com/mailman/listinfo/jazzproglist
> List archive: http://lists.jazzweek.com/pipermail/jazzproglist/
> Sponsorship information: jplsponsor at jazzweek.com
>
>
>
> --
>
> Jazz Programmers' Mailing List: jazzproglist at jazzweek.com
> List information: http://lists.jazzweek.com/mailman/listinfo/jazzproglist
> List archive: http://lists.jazzweek.com/pipermail/jazzproglist/
> Sponsorship information: jplsponsor at jazzweek.com
>
>
> --
>
> Jazz Programmers' Mailing List: jazzproglist at jazzweek.com
> List information: http://lists.jazzweek.com/mailman/listinfo/jazzproglist
> List archive: http://lists.jazzweek.com/pipermail/jazzproglist/
> Sponsorship information: jplsponsor at jazzweek.com
>


--

Jazz Programmers' Mailing List: jazzproglist at jazzweek.com
List information: http://lists.jazzweek.com/mailman/listinfo/jazzproglist
List archive: http://lists.jazzweek.com/pipermail/jazzproglist/
Sponsorship information: jplsponsor at jazzweek.com

-- 
Scanned by MailScanner


-- 
Scanned by MailScanner



More information about the jazzproglist mailing list