[Norton AntiSpam]Re: [JPL] Zenph "re-performance"

Nou Dadoun nou.dadoun at gmail.com
Tue Nov 8 12:20:05 EST 2011


Some of this is reminiscent of the old artificial intelligence debates (I
know I have an unusual background here) where part of some researcher's
goals was to analyze the "intelligence"/elements of style that would allow
(re)creation of new works "in the style" of the originators - is a goal to
allow new works to be (re)-preformed in the style of Oscar or Art?  Does
art have a soul?  What is the nature of creativity?

The NYT article criticisms also reminded of other aspects of AI like chess
playing, it's possible to get to very very good chess programs reasonably
quickly (they're sometimes used as class projects now in upper level
computer science courses) but how does one get to grandmaster levels of
intuition and inspiration?  Some interesting questions (that are probably
out of the scope of this discussion, sorry) ... N



On Tue, Nov 8, 2011 at 3:57 AM, Eric Gruner <eric at jazz901.org> wrote:

>
> I agree, I somehow feel cheated out of a real performance.   Here's a quote
> from an conversation with an acquaintance that I had off list:  "I think of
> it outside of the “jazzworld” more of a side-show spectacle but not in a
> bad way. If this curiosity gets someone interest in jazz, Oscar or
> improvising I’m all for it."   Again,  interesting from a technological
> standpoint, but I'd rather hear Marian Petrescu interpret  ( or
> "recreate")   an Oscar Peterson composition, perhaps bringing something new
> to it, than to hear a machine "re-perform" anything.   Additionally, I'd
> rather play a new release that might include some original compositions.
> Sam Yahel .. maybe?   :)  There's way too many of those that get passed
> on.
>
>
>
> On Mon, Nov 7, 2011 at 7:59 PM, Bradley Stone <stonebradley1 at gmail.com
> >wrote:
>
> >
> > Aloha,
> >
> > It may be "good science" and fantastic technology (I agree, from a
> > scientific perspective), but there is something kind of disturbing to me
> > about this - I felt that way when I first read about it, too -  and I'm
> not
> > sure that I can articulate precisely what it is.
> >
> > I think I would rather play an old Art Tatum record, scratches and maybe
> > even bad piano and all.  I would also rather play a new artist, composing
> > his/her own new compositions, quite frankly.
> >
> > The light is on,
> >
> > Brad Stone
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > On Mon, Nov 7, 2011 at 9:06 AM, Louis Erlanger <louisx at myfairpoint.net
> > >wrote:
> >
> > >
> > > Already have, and I stand by my opinion. I'm not young any more and
> I've
> > > seen many new technologies take hold, and each one generated the same
> > kind
> > > of arguments against it. Of course, there's nothing like being in the
> > same
> > > room with the musician who is playing, but when that's not possible,
> all
> > > the alternatives have their drawbacks and in the end the ears and heart
> > are
> > > the only good judges. Mine tell me Zenph is on to a promising idea.
> > >
> > >
> > > -----Original Message----- From: EdBride at aol.com
> > > Sent: Monday, November 07, 2011 11:36 AM
> > > To: jazzproglist at jazzweek.com
> > > Subject: Re: [Norton AntiSpam]Re: [JPL] Zenph "re-performance"
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Are you talking about the process or the result?
> > >
> > > If you visit their website, you will easily discover that there's a
> world
> > > of difference in the process and in the reproduction (I like that term
> > > "re-performance") of the sound. In fact, if you review the messages on
> > this
> > > thread, you will see the differences articulated.
> > >
> > > Ed
> > >
> > >
> > > In a message dated 11/7/2011 11:25:22 A.M. Eastern Standard Time,
> > > louisx at myfairpoint.net writes:
> > >
> > >
> > > I'm  not sure there's that much difference between what Zenph is doing
> > and
> > > "cleaning up" old recordings.
> > >
> > >
> > > --
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> > >
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> >
> >
> > --
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>
> --
> Eric Gruner
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-- 
====
Nou Dadoun
The A-Trane on the air since 1986 | CFRO 102.7 FM, Vancouver BC
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