[JPL] Promotion people, a rant

david avery info at powderfingerpromo.com
Thu Nov 17 08:57:56 EST 2011


there's no accounting for taste--one person's crap is another person's good
music--but any promoter should provide their clients with a weekly report
and be available for a phone call once in awhile for more personalized
feedback. that's pretty standard for any format. but a potential client
also bears some responsibility just like any other consumer--they can ask
for references and/or do some investigating of their own via the internet
pretty easily. and since some jazz programmers are only available late at
night (or maybe not comfortable on the phone) it's only reasonable that
some will be contacted via phone and others via email, so that's kind of
beside the point. however, the other problem besides the lack of integrity
of a "promoter" straight-up taking someone's money and doing nothing is
that it makes ALL of us look bad. a few years back there was a "publicist"
in my area who managed to get several well-known local artists as clients,
duped pretty much everyone in the local music biz, and turned out to be a
mentally unstable fraud who was throwing CDs in the dumpster and claiming
that they were sent out for reviews--she even went as far as to pay a low
level local writer to write reviews for her victims/clients. now THAT is
ripping someone off. and the result was that it was very difficult for
several years for the legitimate publicists in the area to get clients, and
a few went out of business or moved from the area as a result. it was a
terrible situation all around and hurt many people who weren't even
directly involved. very bad indeed.

-david avery
powderfinger promotions



On Wed, Nov 16, 2011 at 6:17 PM, mfa - jazz radio promotion, publicity &
consulting <MitchellFeldmanAssociates at charter.net> wrote:

>
> I second that, Jane - and Mark, couldn't have said it better myself!
>
> Mitchell
> [JPL] Promotion people, a rant
>
> Jane Dashow jazzzdog at nyc.rr.com
> Wed Nov 16 16:35:43 EST 2011
> Previous message: [JPL] Promotion people, a rant
> Next message: [JPL] Today's Plays
> Messages sorted by: [ date ] [ thread ] [ subject ] [ author ]
> Here here Mark!
>
> Jane Dashow
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: jazzproglist-bounces at jazzweek.com
> [mailto:jazzproglist-bounces at jazzweek.com] On Behalf Of Mark Rini
> Sent: Wednesday, November 16, 2011 4:28 PM
> To: jazzproglist at jazzweek.com
> Subject: Re: [JPL] Promotion people, a rant
>
>
> Ricky,
>
>
>
> By the lack of replies, it seems that this is something most would rather
> not discuss. As a long time radio promoter, it is, to say the least, very
> disturbing to hear this again.
>
>
>
> We've been contacted by a few labels/artists ourselves that had similar
> experiences as you described with certain other promoters. One well known
> and one I wasn't familiar with  Not returning a clients call, one who has
> paid you good money, is bullshit and creates a stigma that all of the other
> legit  records reps have to deal with.
>
>
>
> I think it would be in poor form for one promoter to out another, as it
> could be misconstrued as sour grapes, but I do think that person(s) should
> be held accountable, so as far as I'm concerned...they should be outed by
> the burned client . I know Josh and I, as well as a few others out there
> who are legit, work too damn hard for someone to tarnish the image of what
> we do. Artists and labels deserve to know this info.
>
>
>
> While I don't think any promoter can guarantee spectacular chart results
> as I said to you off list, the effort should be a given. We're dealing with
> someone's art, passion and livelihood. Respect for it is mandatory.
>
>
>
>
>
> Thanks for having the "stones" to keep bringing this up.
>
>
>
>
>
> Mark
>
>
> On Tue, Nov 15, 2011 at 3:01 PM, <onthebeach at aol.com> wrote:
>
> >
> > allow me to weigh in, and quote Peter Drucker to begin:
> > "The aim of marketing is to know and understand the customer
> >  so well the product or service fits him and sells itself."
> > this also includes understanding, as matthias points out, that not every
> > release is going to work
> >  for every station...or any station perhaps.
> >
> >
> > this dovetails in to something i alluded to recently:  THERE ARE SOME
> > WEAK-ASS promotion people out there,
> > bordering on "thieves".  some with rather popular, high-profiles.  record
> > promotion can be augmented
> > with email but nothing replaces speaking with the other person.  and a
> > promotion person provides a service
> > for which their client pays them.  while the client must understand there
> > can be no guarantees regarding success,
> > at minimum, the promoter must respect their client and the money...they
> > must earn the money by
> > MAKING REAL EFFORT AND BY COMMUNICATING (PROVIDING FEEDBACK) TO THE
> CLIENT.
> >
> >
> > i recently had a consulting client who couldnt connect with my
> recommended
> > promoter.  the way this artist was treated
> > borders on RIPPED OFF: no meaningful feedback, no quotes, no track
> > information.  shakey, inconsistent tracking sheets
> > that to a professional eye looked made up.  even worse? this promoter
> > wouldnt take phone calls and essentially blew off
> > the client's request via email and gave the absolute minimal answer when
> > and if they responded.
> >
> >
> > this particular artist gave the promoter something to work with: a track
> > record with some upper half of the chart titles;
> > some notable guest artists, some really solid music compatible with jazz
> > radio AND was already bubbling under the chart!
> > (oh yeah and the  had titles and times in all the right places).
> >
> >
> > this promoter so lacked professionalism and respect for this client THEY
> > SHOULD BE OUTED!  every promoter must understand
> > what they take on, and importantly the CO$T$ to the artist.  they commit
> a
> > couple grand to pay you + the cost of sample CDs,
> > mailers and postage.  times are tough for everybody.  if an artist
> > delivers a project that is embraced by dozens of reporters,
> > at the minimum they deserve to know what tracks are getting spun and they
> > should walk away from the campaign with at least
> > a couple of notable quotes to add to their press kit, web site, social
> > networks etc.
> >
> >
> > i wish i could wave a magic wand and BANISH the few miserly greedy
> > promoters.  the good guys and gals would have a little more pie to share
> > and would be doing ok. if you are a service provider, the client always
> > comes first!
> >
> >
> > bright moments,
> > ricky schultz
> > www.jazzconsultant.com
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Bobby Jackson <ftapache1 at sbcglobal.net>
> > To: jazzproglist <jazzproglist at jazzweek.com>
> > Sent: Tue, Nov 15, 2011 3:24 am
> > Subject: Re: [JPL] Promotion people
> >
> >
> >
> > The answer is simple Matthias......  They are doing their job.  Do your
> > job.
> >
> > Bobby Jackson
> > THE JAZZ MIND
> > www.thejazzmind.com
> > ftapache1 at sbcglobal.net
> > cell: 216.288.4422
> > home: 216.281.3936
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > On Nov 15, 2011, at 10:27 AM, Matthias Kirsch wrote:
> >
> > >
> > > Why is it that some promotion people simply won't accept the fact that
> > the
> > > artist they are representing
> > > is simply not suuitable or not good enough?
> > > I'm exchanging emails here for a couple of hours from someone in
> Brooklyn
> > > representing a Russian vocalist
> > > who I think is simply very far below average....
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Matthias
> > >
> > > Matthias Kirsch
> > > Head of Music
> > > JazzRadio 106.8 Berlin and www.jazzradio.net
> > >
> > >
> > > --
> > >
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> >
> >
> >
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> >
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>
>
> --
> Mark Rini
> GROOV Marketing-NW
> 204 SE 6th Circle
> Battle Ground, WA 98604
> Direct: 360-666-3046
>
> mark at groovmarketing.com
>
> http://www.groovmarketing.com
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